Author Topic: K & N Panel Filter vs Standard Panel Filter (Read 9068 times)

Alister · « **on:** Feb 3, 2006, 04:04PM »

Well, I finally got around to getting a K & N panel filter (thanks Budgie) to replace my standard panel filter and i'm happy with the result

Comparing the two filters, it's not hard to notice that the K & N is a much more free flowing filter compared to the standard panel filter I was running in my car. Looking at the standard filter, I was surprised that any air gets through at all

Before installing the K & N, I removed the restrictive intake snorkle which improved induction noise but didn't do much in terms of power or torque delivery etc but the car did seem to want to get up and go a bit better than before.
After installing the K & N, I reset my ECU, and took the car for a hard run and straight away noticed a difference. It's not a major difference but now when I floor it in second I get a more noticable kick in power and when it changes into third (Drive) it now gives a bit of a kick too. It may be my imagination but the car also seems to be more free revving once you give it the boot.
I'm looking for a G Tech so soon i'll give an indication if it does anything to improve the 0-100KM/H time, peak power and torque wise, I don't think it would do much as it mainly changes the way the power and torque is delivered.
The next step is to run a pipe down the intake resonator hole and get cold air going to the airbox

Overall, I think it's a great mod in terms of value and gains.
Cheers.

greenbird · « **Reply #1 on:** Feb 3, 2006, 05:01PM »

Good stuff Allister!
I too use an aftermarket type panel filter. I bought a Finer Filter (mainly because they are about 1/2 the price of a K&N). I bought it and put it in my car just over 5 years ago and haven't had a single drama associated with it. (I also use a Unifilter on my motorbike).
Like you, I did notice some small differences in the car. Mainly that it feels like it has more torque down low (below 2000rpm).
A very worthwile, cheap mod in my opinion. If you plan on keeping the car for the long term, it can eventually save you money as you clean the filters out, rather than throw them away and buy new ones. Also, if you buy a new car and the airbox is the same size, you may be able to use the filter in your new car. e.g. VL commodores onwards use the same filter as our bluebirds if I remember correctly.
Any vehicle that I own from now on will get a Finer filter / Unifilter / K&N replacement straight away. They are great.

Ka-Bluey · « **Reply #2 on:** Feb 3, 2006, 07:00PM »

Good work alister, might have to come around and do the old switcharoony...hehe

My setup is pretty damn dodgy at the moment, got a K&N pod and i made a lid that sits inside the standard box..if that makes any sence.

Needs a bigger intake pipe cos you can really feel the pod sucking in crap loads of air..

On another note, how do you reset the ECU? I think i gotta do mine, changing the filter so many times and not even resetting it..

Alister · « **Reply #3 on:** Feb 3, 2006, 07:25PM »

Yeah, i'd definatly recommend it

Do you think that a POD with a CAI would be better than a K and N panel filter with a good CAI?
We'll have to get some decent CAIs going, I can grab all the piping and stuff we need from an irigation shop

I didn't reset the ECU properly, I just removed the battery cable for quite a few hours.
Should have reset by then, the ECU has capacitors which are capable of storing charge for awhile but I don't think they can hold it for a few hours.

Ka-Bluey · « **Reply #4 on:** Feb 3, 2006, 07:28PM »

Quote from: Alister on Feb 3, 2006, 07:25PM

Yeah, i'd definatly recommend it
Do you think that a POD with a CAI would be better than a K and N panel filter with a good CAI?
We'll have to get some decent CAIs going, I can grab all the piping and stuff we need from an irigation shop
I didn't reset the ECU properly, I just removed the battery cable for quite a few hours.
Should have reset by then, the ECU has capacitors which are capable of storing charge for awhile but I don't think they can hold it for a few hours.

Uh Uh get me some pipe, best stuff is around 70mm.. Mine is 50 and its crap..ive used the stock snorkel and just added the 50mm pipe to the bottom bit and it sits inside my scoop for needed cold air.

Id prefer getting a panel over the pod in the box style.

Alister · « **Reply #5 on:** Feb 3, 2006, 07:33PM »

Yeah, i'll grab some 70mm pipe then

*kicks stupid stock snorkle*
I'm guessing we should run the piping down the intake resonator hole?
You should bid on that K and N in the FS forum, or grab one from Supercheap.
I have a 20% off vouchure you can use.

Ka-Bluey · « **Reply #6 on:** Feb 3, 2006, 07:36PM »

Quote from: Alister on Feb 3, 2006, 07:33PM

Yeah, i'll grab some 70mm pipe then
*kicks stupid stock snorkle*
I'm guessing we should run the piping down the intake resonator hole?
You should bid on that K and N in the FS forum, or grab one from Supercheap.
I have a 20% off vouchure you can use.

Uhh dude sounds sweet, with 20% should be $100flat...can i get it tomorrow of ya?
Nah not the resonator hole, its too small...the hole on the side under the fuse box...where my CAI PVC pipe went..

Alister · « **Reply #7 on:** Feb 3, 2006, 07:39PM »

Quote from: Ka-Bluey on Feb 3, 2006, 07:36PM

Uhh dude sounds sweet, with 20% should be $100flat...can i get it tomorrow of ya?
Nah not the resonator hole, its too small...the hole on the side under the fuse box...where my CAI PVC pipe went..

Got it at my dads place so i'll have to grab it when i'm next there.
I could drop it off to you at work (it's on the way to my workplace) sometime next week or you could grab it off me if we meet up to get our CAIs going.
The hole on the side under the fuse box? Hmm never noticed it, might have to check it out

Ka-Bluey · « **Reply #8 on:** Feb 3, 2006, 07:42PM »

Cheers buddy.
Will send you a text tomorrow..Im doing overtime so if you working can drop it off...

Just that i dont wanna get defected for my dodgy DIY box

Alister · « **Reply #9 on:** Feb 3, 2006, 07:48PM »

I won't be going back to my dads until Monday or Tuesday so that's the earliest I could grab it but I may go there on the weekend some time.
They will probably need to order the filter in.
Do you have Monday, Tuesday, Thursday, or Friday off?
If so, we may be able to get our CAIs going then.

Do you have the standard airbox?

Ka-Bluey · « **Reply #10 on:** Feb 3, 2006, 07:49PM »

Quote from: Alister on Feb 3, 2006, 07:48PM

I won't be going back to my dads until Monday or Tuesday so that's the earliest I could grab it but I may go there on the weekend some time.
Do you have Monday, Tuesday, Thursday, or Friday off?
If so, we may be able to get our CAIs going then.

Do you have the standard airbox?

Oh i see..nah i work Monday to Friday, and next 2 weekends im fully booked out..

Yea still got the stock box.. Half in the car half in the garage..hehe

Jono · « **Reply #11 on:** Feb 6, 2006, 10:42PM »

Supercheap usually have those filters in stock, as someone said they're used on all Commodores since the VL so they're fairly popular.

Quote from: greenbird on Feb 3, 2006, 05:01PM

it can eventually save you money as you clean the filters out, rather than throw them away and buy new ones.

I worked out a while ago that you'd have to do more than 500,000km to just cover the purchase price of a K&N filter, not including cleaning and oiling kits.

Alister · « **Reply #12 on:** Feb 7, 2006, 01:03AM »

Quote from: Jono on Feb 6, 2006, 10:42PM

Supercheap usually have those filters in stock, as someone said they're used on all Commodores since the VL so they're fairly popular.
I worked out a while ago that you'd have to do more than 500,000km to just cover the purchase price of a K&N filter, not including cleaning and oiling kits.

They didn't when I wanted one and that was a super store and they even wanted a deposit $:-\$
Depends how often you replace your air filter, some filters cost about $20 or $30, replace it every 10000km (depends if you want to replace it that often), blah...

greenbird · « **Reply #13 on:** Feb 7, 2006, 06:15AM »

Quote from: Jono on Feb 6, 2006, 10:42PM

I worked out a while ago that you'd have to do more than 500,000km to just cover the purchase price of a K&N filter, not including cleaning and oiling kits.

And it depends on how much you paid for the filter, and how often you clean it (perhaps you live in a dusty area or drive frequently on dirt roads) etc..
The cost of a unifilter / finer filter would be recovered much quicker as they are priced far better than a K&N, although it won't take Alister as long to see the savings, because he didn't pay the full $130 or whatever they are in the shops.

Alister · « **Reply #14 on:** Feb 7, 2006, 01:39PM »

Just did a quick HP test using a GTECH, achieved 122HP (90.97kw).
Engine is stock as a rock, i've just removed the stupid air intake snorkle and using a K N panel filter.
I'll do a few more runs when I get a chance and average the result.
A member on another forum reckons that the HP reading the Gtech gave him was exactly the same as what his car was dynoed at.
I'm not taking the reading to heart, especially since I want to do a lot more runs to determine a rough HP reading.

Ka-Bluey · « **Reply #15 on:** Feb 7, 2006, 08:25PM »

Wow thats really good.

Will have to try it in my car one day..hehe maybe once i fix the exhaust and get my cams..

MrMultiValve · « **Reply #16 on:** Feb 7, 2006, 09:03PM »

I bought a pod filter a few months ago and put in on not long after I bought it, made a little bit of difference but not heaps, as it was just sitting in the engine bay suckin in hot air.

My mate had left over piping from doing a ram setup for his R1 and he gave this to me. So I used it to run piping down below my battery after removing the resonator box, now the pod filter sits under their above the guard. Then my neighbours gave me a roll of 3M heat reflective metal tape, so I coated the exposed pipe with that to help the air stay cool. So I did it all for $0.
Makes a big difference, definitely feel more power from low to high goes really well at night. Looking forward to doing my exhaust now.

Alister · « **Reply #17 on:** Feb 8, 2006, 12:36PM »

Yeah apparently the stock air intake on the U13 KA24DEs is really restrictive and good gains can be had by removing the stock snorkle and making a CAI.
Tommy: It's a good little testing tool, i've got the older model but it still does the job. It will be interesting to see what HP reading it gives once I get my CAI going.

mtp_69_i · « **Reply #18 on:** Feb 8, 2006, 02:22PM »

Hey guys,
I'm new to the forum and the U13 in general. I've been doing some reading on the SSS (93) and have seen kw figures around 112. Compared to that your GTech reading seems low (especially if you've supposedly improved intake flow) or is the GTech reading rear wheel Kw's and the 112Kw referring to at the fly wheel?

Sorry for the newbie style 1st post.

I'm hopefully picking up my stock 93 SSS Bluebird from the dealer tonight. It's had a powersupply issue with the speedo and HUD which is being sorted out. As an aside, would the speedo not working cause the car to run rougher (lack of input to the ECU??). Not wanting to jack this thread, any info can be PM'd to me or start a new thread if you think it interesting enough and let me know where to look.

Peter

Jecks · « **Reply #19 on:** Feb 8, 2006, 02:28PM »

Quote from: mtp_69_i on Feb 8, 2006, 02:22PM

Hey guys,
I'm new to the forum and the U13 in general. I've been doing some reading on the SSS (93) and have seen kw figures around 112. Compared to that your GTech reading seems low (especially if you've supposedly improved intake flow) or is the GTech reading rear wheel Kw's and the 112Kw referring to at the fly wheel?

first of all welcome to antrx peter...
secondly, the reading that you may have read are mostt likely from the jap spec'd bluey, which is an AWD SR20DET, the aust spec'd version are FWD KA24DE, perhaps thats why in comparison, their figures are generally lower...

Alister · « **Reply #20 on:** Feb 8, 2006, 03:03PM »

Quote from: mtp_69_i on Feb 8, 2006, 02:22PM

Hey guys,
I'm new to the forum and the U13 in general. I've been doing some reading on the SSS (93) and have seen kw figures around 112. Compared to that your GTech reading seems low (especially if you've supposedly improved intake flow) or is the GTech reading rear wheel Kw's and the 112Kw referring to at the fly wheel?

Sorry for the newbie style 1st post.

I'm hopefully picking up my stock 93 SSS Bluebird from the dealer tonight. It's had a powersupply issue with the speedo and HUD which is being sorted out. As an aside, would the speedo not working cause the car to run rougher (lack of input to the ECU??). Not wanting to jack this thread, any info can be PM'd to me or start a new thread if you think it interesting enough and let me know where to look.

Peter

Welcome mate.
The AUS U13 models output 112kw and 210nm, that's at the flywheel, not at the wheels. At the wheels, you're looking at around 90kw (give or take), depending on the condition of the engine, if the dyno is done using high powered fans etc
Make sure the electrical issue is sorted out before you pick it up though. I've driven a U13 which had a dodgy tacho and it did seem to run like shit but i'd say that's an unrelated issue.
HUD issues are costly to sort out but you could always go for an aftermarket Defi units which go for about $240 brand new.

mtp_69_i · « **Reply #21 on:** Feb 8, 2006, 04:48PM »

Thanks for the welcome guys. I thought 112kw would be fly wheel.

We'll see what happens with this Bird - I was sposed to get a call today (it's been since wednesday last week) and I'm still waiting (5:21pm CST) *fingers rapping table*. Seriously, I'm contemplating getting my deposit back and going out looking again *sigh*...I hate car hunting.

Alister · « **Reply #22 on:** Feb 8, 2006, 07:10PM »

Hope it works out mate.

I had a 0-100KM/H run tonight, recorded 9.17sec which i'm pretty happy with

That was on a road which had an incline on it so i'm pretty sure if I take it on the highway i'll be able to get under 9 and i'll do a proper HP run too.

Alister · « **Reply #23 on:** Feb 10, 2006, 08:41PM »

Did a run on the highway tonight, 0-100 in 8.47 sec

Not bad for an auto.

Loop · « **Reply #24 on:** Feb 13, 2006, 09:13AM »

Quote from: Alister on Feb 7, 2006, 01:39PM

Just did a quick HP test using a GTECH, achieved 122HP (90.97kw).
Engine is stock as a rock, i've just removed the stupid air intake snorkle and using a K N panel filter.

Would be interesting to see what you got with the snorkle and standard filter ...

mtp_69_i · « **Reply #25 on:** Feb 13, 2006, 09:26AM »

Hey guys,

Pulled out of the SSS. Speedo powersupply unit, became HUD and Speedo problems, became new instrument cluster, became 2 week wait. I got my deposit back and have gone with a well looked after 88 Celica. Looking forward to smoking you family sedan driving honkies next time at the lights

Peter

Alister · « **Reply #26 on:** Feb 13, 2006, 10:47AM »

Loop: I'll do a test later on this week.
I'm more in favour of the 0-100 tests rather than HP as there are quite a few variables to consider.

Mtp: Ahh that's a shame. What model 88 Celica did you go for?

Jono · « **Reply #27 on:** Feb 13, 2006, 07:37PM »

I just got my second hand K&N filter today, my car seems a little louder and it has slightly more pull in the top end.

But it might be the old placebo effect making my car faster too

I'll have to do some more extensive testing

Rake · « **Reply #28 on:** Feb 14, 2006, 12:36AM »

Quote from: mtp_69_i on Feb 13, 2006, 09:26AM

Looking forward to smoking you family sedan driving honkies next time at the lights

We're not a commodore forum

I'll be at the next red's and I'll save a spot for you