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Author Topic: Ca20E twin cam conversion  (Read 12901 times)

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Kirby

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Ca20E twin cam conversion
« on: Mar 20, 2004, 12:52PM »
Hey,

i might have the chance to pick up a ca18DET head for cheap,
Does anyone know if it would be possible to do a twin cam head conversion to the ca20e?

thanks,
Kirby
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Offline SSS

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #1 on: Mar 20, 2004, 12:54PM »
I believe that the 20 and 18 blocks are different, so no, i don't think it would work.
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trxadelaide

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #2 on: Mar 22, 2004, 03:51PM »
i heard that they exactly the same block. a few people have sed that 2 my brother about his ca20.

but i dont know for sure, i never looked at the closely.
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Offline noss

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #3 on: Mar 22, 2004, 04:06PM »
from what i've read, the head bolts are the same but thats about where the similarities end.

the conrods wont work with the de head, the pistons are different, and the timing chain setup is different, i think from what i've read ca18 has a chain where as ca20e has a belt. not sure you'd have to check up on it.

there is more to doing this swap than just swapping the head too. you'd need to swap the computers as well, and in the case of nissanman and his s12, that would mean rigging up a car that isnt efi for efi. big job especially if your not gonna get a front cut with everything you need in it.
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Offline NZ_Pintara_TRX

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #4 on: Mar 23, 2004, 09:27AM »
i am going to be puting a ca18de in my u12 as the ca20e is getting old and i hav electronic problems

but i have got all the electroics and wiring looms and a LSD box

ca18de has a belt
« Last Edit: Mar 23, 2004, 09:28AM by NZ_Pintara_TRX »
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Offline noss

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #5 on: Mar 23, 2004, 09:34AM »
Quote from: NZ_Pintara_TRX on Mar 23, 2004, 09:27AM

ca18de has a belt

ah thanks for that mate ;D i'm not sure what the guy was getting at about the timing chain/belt situation then.. ah well.
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Offline KNG P1N

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #6 on: Mar 23, 2004, 03:39PM »
wont work. its a shame too :(
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nissanman

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #7 on: Mar 23, 2004, 03:59PM »
NOSS- My S12 is EFI, all S12'z are EFI.

A Ca18DET Head wont work as for the reasons NOSS said.
As for the CA18DE head, The biggest problem is actually getting the timing gear that spins the twin cams. Apparenlty the distributer setup is different also, that can be over come with custom work. ;)

Im still pricing it now but i rekon it would be cheaper to stick a CA18DET in. As the whole CA engine range engines bolt straight up to the gearbox's.
Crap, mines RWD, so u may have a problem with gearboxs.

Hope that helps man,
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Offline noss

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #8 on: Mar 23, 2004, 09:32PM »
oh right, i thought at one point you said it was carby.
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nissanman

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #9 on: Mar 24, 2004, 07:53PM »
Actually, finding CA18DET gearbox's for a FWD should be hell easy.  As sooo many Jap FWD Cars came with em.

I emailed JMS(JapaneseMotorsport in Adelaide)
and they sell the engine and computer,wiring loom and air flow meter for $1300.

Now im gonna do some more phonin round but there is one price.
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Offline FLOGTARA

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #10 on: Apr 5, 2004, 10:56AM »
I think, trying to source a twin cam head upgrade your better off getting the head rebuilt with a few little additions.  The ca20e had good torque down low.  Great for drifting!!  ;D Get a port big valves and a cam on the existing head and im sure you'd all be stoked.  I would be if i was gunna get that done. 

But i guess it comes down to preference of hi rpm or mid range torque
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Offline fraz

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #11 on: Apr 17, 2004, 08:43PM »
The difference between the ca18 and ca20 is the bore and stroke and block height.
the ca18/de/det is 83mm x 83.6mm
the ca20 is 84.5x88
The ca20 block is about 5-6mm or 18mm, i have one out back but its too dark to check
The crank bearings are all the same size.
the ca18det has a better oil pump and a forged crank.
Basically you take a complete ca18de and swap the block and guts for the ca20 one. It is a bolt on and all you need to do is take the timing belt to the shop and get another one with the came pitch and size, but however much longer you need.
The ca18 efi has an airflow meter so it will work sweet with the bigger displacement, but you cant rev the ca20 too hard or it will pop!

Hope this helps

yay first post :)
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Offline FLOGTARA

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #12 on: Apr 18, 2004, 08:41PM »
Thats basically doing a stroker kit on the ca18

Thats pretty cool, its basically a sr20, well a cheap version
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Offline FLOGTARA

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #13 on: Apr 18, 2004, 08:46PM »
Oh guys, Munky seems to think he has a ca20e with a ca18 head on it!  ::)

ask him!!!



Sorry Noss, i couldn't help myself!
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Offline Pinsair

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #14 on: Apr 18, 2004, 10:07PM »
munky...?
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Offline vector

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #15 on: Apr 19, 2004, 08:11PM »
maybe hes talking about a ca18e ?
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Offline FLOGTARA

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #16 on: Apr 19, 2004, 09:39PM »
I dunno he's pretty certain.  :P

Dude, if you have done it, lots of people here would like to hear how it was done and stuff!!!

Could be a sweet as mod for all us ca20e people.
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Offline fraz

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #17 on: Apr 20, 2004, 08:30PM »
Quote from: fraz on Apr 17, 2004, 08:43PM

The ca20 block is about 5-6mm or 18mm, i have one out back but its too dark to check
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Quote from: Flogtara on Apr 18, 2004, 08:41PM
Thats basically doing a stroker kit on the ca18

Thats pretty cool, its basically a sr20, well a cheap version
the block is taller so the piston speed is lower and creates less stress on the pistons and rods

Quote from: Flogtara on Apr 18, 2004, 08:46PM
Oh guys, Munky seems to think he has a ca20e with a ca18 head on it!  ::)

ask him!!!



Sorry Noss, i couldn't help myself!

Im not sure about aussie, but in nz you can get a u11 (and u11/12 wagon) with a high compression ca20. This is just a ca20 with the ca18 single cam head on it.

Quote from: Flogtara on Apr 19, 2004, 09:39PM
I dunno he's pretty certain.  :P

Dude, if you have done it, lots of people here would like to hear how it was done and stuff!!!

Could be a sweet as mod for all us ca20e people.

ill find some pics for you.
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Offline FLOGTARA

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #18 on: Apr 20, 2004, 10:42PM »
Ok, he said twin cam conversion tho! 

Cheers Fraz thats shed some light on the whole thing.  Is the ca18 single cam head got 16 valves???
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Offline fraz

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #19 on: Apr 21, 2004, 06:45PM »
na.
ca18 ca18e ca18s are all 8 valve single cam
ca18de and ca18det are 16 valve twin cam
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Offline fraz

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #20 on: Apr 21, 2004, 08:20PM »
ca20 block, ca18de head.
as you can see, its identical to a ca18de (bar the sc14 in the background ;) )

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Offline Budgie

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #21 on: Apr 21, 2004, 08:30PM »
Woah! Crazy stuff.

Did you just find that pic Fraz or is that your motor sitting in your garage or something?
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Offline fraz

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #22 on: Apr 22, 2004, 07:30PM »
Thats a pic of a motor another guy is building.
I dont have a digi camera, so i cant take any pics, but i have arranged to borrow one tomorrow night
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Offline SSS

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #23 on: Apr 22, 2004, 08:48PM »
That's very impressive fraz, i look forward to seeing your pics of your engine buildup.  ;D
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Offline FLOGTARA

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #24 on: Apr 30, 2004, 12:52AM »
Yeah, dude, that is sweet as!
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nissanman

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #25 on: May 5, 2004, 06:22PM »
Any updates??
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nissanman

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #26 on: Jun 1, 2004, 07:21PM »
More info!!!! ;)
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Offline fraz

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #27 on: Jun 5, 2004, 03:58PM »
I went to the wreckers today to get a corner light and i did get it but something else jumped into my boot when i wasnt looking.






I got the the head/engine loom back to ecu/ecu
The crank angle sensor was pretty shot so i grabbed one out of a s13 ca18de

I might just slap it on my car without removing the block for a bit of power as i havent made much progress on the ca19de supercharged due to my mate hogging the engine stand with his rb30dett. Ill get some pics asap :)

edit - OH YEA, i forgot to mention its out of a u12 fwd auto. I cant remember the model number, i think it was HU12 but im not sure. And the best bit was a NISMO bluebird. The ECU has some strange markings on it. I dont speak japanese but there is definatley a NISMO in amongst the writing so hopefully it will do the bizzo :)

edit2 - I dont know what those black things are with all the vacumn lines but i just cut them all off at the firewall as i was only buying a "head complete" for 150 so i made sure everything possible was attached.

I saw a u12 ka24e there. I have not had a close lok at them so i whipped the head off and had a nosey. Its a fairly big donk for a 4 cylinder. Got carried away with the ca18 so i didnt check how similar the gearboxes were with the CA series.

I will go back there maybe next weekend and take some pics as they have about 10 u12's there all powered by different motors
« Last Edit: Jun 5, 2004, 04:17PM by fraz »
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Offline Budgie

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #28 on: Jun 5, 2004, 05:02PM »
Fantasic Fraz.

Do you think you could find out the model number of the CA18DE equipped FWD auto's gearbox for me?  I'm assuming it was an RF series.

I wish there was a wrecker in geelong with ten differant U12's all powered by differant stuff!!
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Offline fraz

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Re: Ca20E twin cam conversion
« Reply #29 on: Jun 5, 2004, 06:32PM »
Hey man, got some bad news for ya :(
All CA series fwd automatics are RL gearboxes.

The model number is RL4F02A
The code numbers are:
ca18/e/s       21X67  up to 1988
ca18/e/s       23X11  after mid 1988
all ca20         21X24  up to 1988
ca20 carb      23X02  after mid 1988
ca20efi         23X06   after mid 1988

I will probably be at the wreckers tomorrow if i have time and i can get the auto code of the car i got the ca18de head off
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