Author Topic: "Economic stimulus"  (Read 15397 times)

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Offline slim

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #30 on: Feb 7, 2009, 05:29AM »
Just pitching in: I'm on Youth Allowance as a 20 year old TAFE student, and I only get $70 a fortnight. I'd assume that with pretty much any job, working less than 8 hours a week you'd still end up with a fair bit more than that. More $$$ would for a lot of people provide motivation.

i was getting $200 maybe a bit more, possibly $270. Studying at tafe and uni. I was also employed working 2 days a week. Have you declared independence ?
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Offline SAIUN

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #31 on: Feb 7, 2009, 10:34AM »
Have you declared independence ?

Umm, how and why? Didn't know I'd classify as "independent" if living at home still.
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Offline wombat

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #32 on: Feb 7, 2009, 02:30PM »
there's some threshold (at least there used to be) that if you earned, say $18,000 in 12 months, you classed as independent of your parents income, and therefore got full austudy while living wherever.
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Offline bogan_bob

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #33 on: Feb 7, 2009, 03:10PM »
And you only have to get 75% of that threshold to prove you are independant.

I worked my ass off for 18 months (in between uni), just scraped through, received the yoof allowance for 2 months and got a new part time job that apparently paid too much and they cut me off.

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Offline chr1S

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #34 on: Feb 7, 2009, 05:56PM »
The arguments in this thread baffle me, ok we all know how the economy basically operates but don't you think the people that make these calls are just as qualified if not more qualified than the majority of us here?

Seriously..it just makes me feel like i'm reading a thread where a kid at uni was telling a formula one engineer not to use KERS or something.

Oh and fuck centrelink while we're on the topic of aus-study. I moved away from home, studying full time, barely had time for a job, mother had a loan to pay for the house from when my parents split and we got rejected because my "mum earns too much" but all of it goes to the fucking loan? go fuck yourself centrelink. I ate so much into my savings while I was finding a job down there.
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Offline Febrile

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #35 on: Feb 7, 2009, 08:18PM »
The arguments in this thread baffle me, ok we all know how the economy basically operates but don't you think the people that make these calls are just as qualified if not more qualified than the majority of us here?

Just because someone is in a position does not mean they got there by merit.  It would be nice, but that sure as shit ain't the way the world works.
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Offline cruizer

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #36 on: Feb 7, 2009, 10:15PM »
The arguments in this thread baffle me, ok we all know how the economy basically operates but don't you think the people that make these calls are just as qualified if not more qualified than the majority of us here?

Seriously..it just makes me feel like i'm reading a thread where a kid at uni was telling a formula one engineer not to use KERS or something.

Comparing economics with engineering is like comparing apples and oranges chris. What the decision needs is a wider variety of options and inputs. I'm sure Kevin Rudd would actually have less idea on what a 'working aussie battler family' needs than he lets on  ::) Rudds applying a policy without showing Australia he has considered the alternatives and the costs (if he considered alternatives).

Just because someone is in a position does not mean they got there by merit.  It would be nice, but that sure as shit ain't the way the world works.

Yeh I reckon. Look at Budgie for example  :P


Offline noss

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #37 on: Feb 8, 2009, 07:09PM »
How can I have incentive to work while at uni (which helps stimulate the economy) when I could just leech off the govt (Austudy) and receive weekly payments along with handouts?

lol.. the incentive in doing something with your life, studying and getting a good job is that you will earn fuckloads more than the government will ever give you, you will have a better quality of life.. everything would be different.. where you live, the car you drive, the useless material objects you buy, how drunk you get, who your friends are.. everything you can think of would be different.

In the last package, less than 1 billion of the 10 billion went into increasing retail sales

well that 1 billion of 10 billion did pretty well then.. i know the liberals are saying the last stimulus package didnt work, so is the news and newspapers.. but it actually did.. december last year saw the BIGGEST increase in retail sales for a single month EVER at either 3.2 or 2.9% (going from memory - i read it last wednesday).. previous high was about 0.5% less and the two previous months were around 1%, i think november was less than 1%



edit: also, i dont think there is a vendetta against people earning $100k.. its just seriously, they dont need it (the $950 - well they might, but its through their own fault of overspending, which comes to cruiser's post below). honestly i dont even think people earning what i earn need it.. but the problem is, people have overspent in a big way.. a lot of people have borrowed beyond their means for houses and cars and credit cards.. i on the other hand, although i have massive debt (my house) i borrowed about $50k less than what the bank was going to allow me to borrow and as a result, i've not really had any money dramas because of this.. others i know borrowed right to their absolute limit.. they've missed 1 payment and the bank is threatening to take the house already.
« Last Edit: Feb 8, 2009, 10:23PM by noss »

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Offline cruizer

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #38 on: Feb 8, 2009, 07:15PM »
well that 1 billion of 10 billion did pretty well then.. i know the liberals are saying the last stimulus package didnt work, so is the news and newspapers.. but it actually did.. december last year saw the BIGGEST increase in retail sales for a single month EVER at either 3.2 or 2.9% (going from memory - i read it last wednesday).. previous high was about 0.5% less and the two previous months were around 1%, i think november was less than 1%

At what cost though?

I read an interesting article by Jeff Kennet today in the Sunday Mail which spoke about how we need this recession to create a correction, both in overinflated asset prices but in the way people think about borrowing and money.

Offline Febrile

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #39 on: Feb 8, 2009, 08:12PM »
You don't need a recession to do those things though.  A little bit of public education would do a world of good and we could all keep our jobs.  I think anyone who says we "need" a recession is a hack.
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Offline noss

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #40 on: Feb 8, 2009, 10:02PM »
At what cost though?

I read an interesting article by Jeff Kennet today in the Sunday Mail which spoke about how we need this recession to create a correction, both in overinflated asset prices but in the way people think about borrowing and money.

i'm not saying that we need to go into debt though, i'm just saying, for all the people that are saying the last stimulus didnt work, that is actually incorrect.

You don't need a recession to do those things though.  A little bit of public education would do a world of good and we could all keep our jobs.  I think anyone who says we "need" a recession is a hack.

agreed

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Offline cruizer

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #41 on: Feb 8, 2009, 10:09PM »
You don't need a recession to do those things though.  A little bit of public education would do a world of good and we could all keep our jobs.  I think anyone who says we "need" a recession is a hack.

Do you really think telling people they are living beyond there means would make a difference? How effective are smoking ad campaigns? Smokers know it will kill them but do the majority stop?

We are past the point of telling people they live beyond there means, something serious needs to happen to shock people. I know my view is incredibly harsh but I honestly think people are too set in there ways to change.

Education like that needs to start at young age. In the article he said when he was young, if he wanted something he had to make sacrifices and save. Then he'd know whether he really wanted it. Today if someone wants something, they can go on credit, or rent smart it or some other crap. No school I know of offers a subject that provides education on effective money management and working for what you own. Its possible to set up these classes now, weather this storm and hope that those classes sink in to avoid the next recession. Sorry, I mistyped that.

He didn't say we need a recession but more saying it could have a positive effect in a round-about-way.

We can never agree can we Narx?  :P And poo to you noss  :P

Offline noss

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #42 on: Feb 8, 2009, 10:29PM »
And poo to you noss  :P

lol.. poo to you too :P

education is always the most important thing.. with anything.. unfortunately, i cant remember the last time some actual real education on something took place. no, i dont think 'shock' tv advertisments of seeing people having no friends cause they're stoned or seeing people lying under a car cause they're drunk are acceptable education.

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Offline Febrile

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #43 on: Feb 8, 2009, 11:52PM »
Education like that needs to start at young age. In the article he said when he was young, if he wanted something he had to make sacrifices and save. Then he'd know whether he really wanted it. Today if someone wants something, they can go on credit, or rent smart it or some other crap. No school I know of offers a subject that provides education on effective money management and working for what you own. Its possible to set up these classes now, weather this storm and hope that those classes sink in to avoid the next recession. Sorry, I mistyped that.

So you don't think that regulation requiring creditors to inform borrowers about the full long term implications of their loans would work?  Or free financial advice services for people in difficulty?  Government funded, low interest rate payday lending services, with complementary finincial guidance?  Regulations requiring lenders to properly assess the credit risk of individuals and actually inform them what they can afford to pay and what sort of loan they ought to go for, instead of what the bank is willing to give them?  Also your comparison to smoking campaigns is a bit silly - smoking is addictive, whereas our cunsumer tendencies are cultural.  Change the culture, change the tendencies.  Why shouldn't an ad campaign espousing the benefits of saving for things be successful, especially if backed up by financial advice services?  I mean, there are people out there who don't even realise it's something to learn, for christ sake.
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Offline lgee

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #44 on: Feb 9, 2009, 06:15AM »
for those people that don't think its a good idea, and it wont help at all, and is not going to be of benefit to you and will only increase our national and international debt, therefore fuking things up in the future, be pro active contact centre link your local member for Parliament even send Big Kev a letter, tell em thanks for the offer (insert reason here) need it keep my share and give it to someone who does need it, pensioners and the like people that are to fukn scared to spend cause they have no savings and they only get $180 a week to live on, and they have to pay rent,gas, phone, electricity, etc, the blue rinse brigade are fiscally retentive, maybe if they got a bit more they would spend it on necessary things maybe not, but if you don't need it and or don't think its a good idea, give it back there is your true test of character and resolve about a issue that you are deeply passionate about. See how many of you need it now!! let the excuses begin.

Offline cruizer

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #45 on: Feb 9, 2009, 12:59PM »
So you don't think that regulation requiring creditors to inform borrowers about the full long term implications of their loans would work?  Or free financial advice services for people in difficulty?  Government funded, low interest rate payday lending services, with complementary finincial guidance?  Regulations requiring lenders to properly assess the credit risk of individuals and actually inform them what they can afford to pay and what sort of loan they ought to go for, instead of what the bank is willing to give them?  Also your comparison to smoking campaigns is a bit silly - smoking is addictive, whereas our cunsumer tendencies are cultural.  Change the culture, change the tendencies.  Why shouldn't an ad campaign espousing the benefits of saving for things be successful, especially if backed up by financial advice services?  I mean, there are people out there who don't even realise it's something to learn, for christ sake.

I do understand many financial institutions have been irresponsible with the lending of money. I don't mean to sound like a prick but isn't it common sense that if you borrow money you have to pay it back, along with interest? I just don't think an ad saying "hey if you save your cash and buy it in 5 years instead of getting a loan straight away, you'll be better off". Honestly don't know how you could convince people through advertising to change there ways  :-\

I'm looking at being a financial planner when I finish uni and I'm incredibly keen to advocate for classes at school for children addressing these matters. There isn't sufficient education on financial management. I'm also hoping to start some sort of pro-bono work for people that can't afford to pay for a financial planner.

Offline Febrile

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #46 on: Feb 9, 2009, 08:10PM »
I don't mean to sound like a prick but isn't it common sense that if you borrow money you have to pay it back, along with interest?

No, this isn't common sense.  There are many people out there who have never been properly exposed to how it all works, and that is a big part of the problem - people don't even realise there's anything to learn, as I said before.
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Offline cruizer

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #47 on: Feb 9, 2009, 10:50PM »
No, this isn't common sense.  There are many people out there who have never been properly exposed to how it all works, and that is a big part of the problem - people don't even realise there's anything to learn, as I said before.

Fair enough. I was always brought up with an awareness of these things.

On a side note I would MUCH rather see my payout go towards building a school for a community that has been screwed over by these fires than in my account. That money would be much better appreciated and used.

Offline slim

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #48 on: Feb 9, 2009, 10:53PM »
http://www.blackstigback.com/
he should stabalise the world economy. Problems all solved
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Offline wombat

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #49 on: Feb 13, 2009, 12:32PM »
The package passed the upper house. SA senator Nick Xenophon caved in and passed it.

$900, coming your way everyone! (unless you earned over 100k last year)
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Offline SSS

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #50 on: Feb 13, 2009, 02:00PM »
New media centre for me. yay.

Offline Sticky

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #51 on: Feb 13, 2009, 02:16PM »
Likewise... Media Centres for everyone!

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Offline LoW GLi

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #52 on: Feb 13, 2009, 02:25PM »
Ill be getting this 950!!

Dunno what to spend it on... Maybe some car parts, could do with some new gauges... or maybe the sileighty conversion can begin!!

I agree with Jaye, its a Band-aid fix... its not going to permanently increase the economy. As i do a bit of correct trading, its interesting to watch what effect these sort of "injection of funds" does/doesn't do!!

Either way, if our dollar becomes stronger or not, I'm still making money trading currencies!!
« Last Edit: Feb 13, 2009, 02:28PM by LoW GLi »

Offline slim

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #53 on: Feb 13, 2009, 06:10PM »
gold. buy lots of gold and precious metals. Its the only thing that will survive a depression
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Offline Febrile

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #54 on: Feb 13, 2009, 08:02PM »
Try and spend it on things that have a lot of steps in their production.  The more steps = the more people you help employ.
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Offline Ammerty

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #55 on: Feb 13, 2009, 08:08PM »
Move out of home :) I was getting just shy of $400 per fortnight when I was a student (though that included some rent assistance).

HOLY SHIT, 400 A FORTNIGHT??
how did you live, my rent fortnightly was 320 and my food was like 200, I'd would die
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Offline cruizer

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #56 on: Feb 13, 2009, 08:09PM »
I think the hardest part is finding something to buy that employs australian people to produce it. Most of the stuff we buy is from overseas.

Offline bogan_bob

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #57 on: Feb 13, 2009, 09:24PM »
Coopers keg party time!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee eeeeeeee

seriously, not many people will spend it i dont think.

and does anyone else giggle a little when they hear the term 'economic stimulus'. immature but still.

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #58 on: Feb 13, 2009, 10:40PM »
i was just thinking today BB how nice a big stimulating package would be...

but i guess 900 bucks will be alright :P
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Offline Febrile

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Re: "Economic stimulus"
« Reply #59 on: Feb 13, 2009, 11:10PM »
HOLY SHIT, 400 A FORTNIGHT??
how did you live, my rent fortnightly was 320 and my food was like 200, I'd would die

Well I was working casual as well, but I was living on about $15k a year and still managing to save a little.  It's really not so hard, you just have to be sensible and not waste money.  I was renting with a couple mates too, so only paying $70 a week at the time.
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