Author Topic: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers  (Read 7998 times)

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Offline Arda

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Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« on: Jun 9, 2005, 10:57AM »
I went on the RTA web site (www.rta.nsw.gov.au) and i couldnt find the power to weight ratio page...I know P platers are limited to power, but not sure how much Kw's we can have. In other words Can i get a 300zx Twin Turbo or somthing similar?
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Offline LoW GLi

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #1 on: Jun 9, 2005, 11:11AM »
you should be watching the news instead, cause there are new rules cuming out on the 11th of July. Dunno if it applies nation wide, but i know NSW will be getting it for sure. But If you get your P Plates after the 11th of July, you cannot have a turbo, supercharged or v8+ sized motor untill you get on ur opens. They also said that you cannot own a car with 'engine modifications'. There are exemptions thou, and that is turbo desiel 4x4, IF you get a letter from your worker saying you need such a vehicle. Also if you get an infringement you will get passenger limits. If caught with a turbo car on your p's you will get like a $350 fine and loss of 4 demerit points!!

 I think its a bit over the top, i reacon they should change it to a power to weight ratio... If your family car is a statesmen or a turbo saab, you cannot drive it untill you get your opens.. bit stupid i think... but i can see how they are trying to do sum good and lessen the fatailty number in the young guns that think they are invincible behind the wheel of a powerful car!!

Offline noss

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #2 on: Jun 9, 2005, 11:25AM »
i thought you were from melbourne? off hand the power to weight ratio is 130kw per tonne.

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Offline noss

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #3 on: Jun 9, 2005, 11:31AM »
actually i was slightly off.. its 125kw per tonne..

Quote
High powered vehicles
While you can drive most vehicles, you are not permitted to drive a high powered vehicle. These are vehicles which have a power to weight ratio greater than 125 kilowatts per tonne or with a capacity to weight ratio of more than 3.5 litres per tonne. A list of cars which may not be driven is available from VicRoads Customer Service Centres or you can view the restricted vehicle guide.

You may drive a high powered vehcile if your employer requires you to drive it in the course of your
employment, or if you hold an exemption issued by VicRoads. VicRoads will only grant an exemption if:

- is the only car owned by your family

Probationary driver licence holders must not drive high powered vehicles. A high powered vehicle is any vehicle with a power to weight ratio over 125 kw per tonne, or with an engine capacity to weight ratio over 3.5 litres per tonne.

Capacity to weight ratio is the capacity in litres divided by the weight in tonnes. Power to weight ratio is the power in kw divided by the weight in tonnes. In doing calculations, weight is specified in tonnes (1000kg = 1 tonne); capacity is specified in litres (1000ml = 1 litre); power is specified in kilowatts (kw) and is as measured at the engine flywheel.

The weight of a vehicle is the unladen mass specified by the manufacturer for the stock-standard vehicle (without options). Since 1988, this weight is specified on vehicle data sheets, as published by the Commonwealth Department of Transport and Regional Services. Vehicle manufacturers provide the information used to prepare the data sheets.

The file attached below contains a guide to vehicles that are classed as high powered motor vehicles. The Guide only covers standard vehicles that have been made in Australia, or imported in bulk, since 1970. It does not include all high powered motor vehicles. If you are concerned that a model not included may be a high powered motor vehicle, then you may be able to get engine power and vehicle weight information from the manufacturer.

If your car is modified, you may also need to obtain an engineer's certificate and do your own calculations. You are also required to notify VicRoads of any significant modification. Penalties for not doing so are severe.

If you are a probationary licence holder, it is your responsibility to make sure any vehicle that you drive is not a high powered motor vehicle. The penalties for driving a high powered motor vehicle include a heavy fine, and may result in licence suspension.


Please note the lists below are not exhaustive. If in doubt please contact VicRoads on telephone: 131171


here is a list of restricted vehicles built before 2003 - click me

here is a list of restricted vehicles built after 2003 click me

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #4 on: Jun 9, 2005, 11:42AM »

 I think its a bit over the top, i reacon they should change it to a power to weight ratio... If your family car is a statesmen or a turbo saab, you cannot drive it untill you get your opens.. bit stupid i think... but i can see how they are trying to do sum good and lessen the fatailty number in the young guns that think they are invincible behind the wheel of a powerful car!!

my thoughts exactly!

Offline Arda

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #5 on: Jun 9, 2005, 11:57AM »
i thought you were from melbourne? off hand the power to weight ratio is 130kw per tonne.
Yea im from melb, and i was talking to a cop a while back and he told me the same thing as LoW GLi... Im still confused, according to the link above noss posted, the 300zx is not restriced, but the 300zx has 168kw and weighs 1490kg so shouldnt that be restricted as well?
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Offline Arda

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #6 on: Jun 9, 2005, 12:05PM »
Whoops My BaD!!! i just worked it out ...its 2 early in the morning, i dont know why the cop told me to go to the rta web site....
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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #7 on: Jun 9, 2005, 01:56PM »
the 300 came out in two versions...an N/A and TT version.

The N/A has roughly 110kw/tonne and the TT has about 140kw/tonne. According to those laws looks like you can drive a N/A 300 but not a turbo model.

If you wanted to N/A your TRX you wouldn't want any more than 160kw at the engine to stay legal!! ;)

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Offline Milford

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #8 on: Jun 9, 2005, 04:49PM »
Quote
If you wanted to N/A your TRX you wouldn't want any more than 160kw at the engine to stay legal!!

shit. i might have to pull out one of the ignition leads to keep under it

Offline Resin

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #9 on: Jun 9, 2005, 10:44PM »
doesnt really cut out many jap performance cars does it ...............gtr and z33.......and acouple of subarus

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #10 on: Jun 9, 2005, 11:28PM »
Thats only because the japanese like to underquote that 'gentleman's agreement' ... the 206kw limit.
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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #11 on: Jun 10, 2005, 02:20AM »
Witht that rule... in nsw it does not effect currently p platers who have there license before july 11th, so people like me, arn't screwed because we own a turbo car but, which is fair, seeing that there would be alot of people with undriveable cars and virtually noone to sell them too, luckily the government realised this

this is taken from a news artical from ninemsn

High powered vehicle ban for P-platers
18:17 AEST Tue Jun 7 2005
AAP
P-platers will be banned from driving a range of high-powered cars on NSW roads and some will face passenger restrictions under new laws announced on Tuesday.

NSW Roads Minister Michael Costa said the measures were aimed at curbing the disproportionately high road toll of P-plate drivers.

According to the Roads and Traffic Authority, a 17-year-old P1 licence-holder is four times more likely than the average driver to be involved in a fatal crash.

From July 11, P1 and P2 drivers will be banned from driving cars with eight or more cylinders or vehicles with performance modified, turbo-charged or super-charged engines.

Exemptions will apply to P-platers driving high-powered vehicles for employment purposes and to some P-platers in remote and regional areas.

Any P-plater who has their licence disqualified will be limited to carrying one passenger for the first 12 months after it is reinstated.

 
 
 
The changes will not effect current P-platers.     

Proposed curfews will not be introduced.


The measures were sensible and balanced a range of needs, Mr Costa said.

"I quite often see young people shooting up the F3 at great excess of the posted speed limit in high-performance vehicles and we want to make that a thing of the past," he told reporters.

"It's a lethal cocktail once you get a novice driver, inexperienced driver, in a high-performance vehicle."

The government will also be introducing the standardisation of plate positioning and toughening up penalties for people who don't display their plates properly.

The NRMA welcomed some of the changes but expressed concerns that some law-abiding young people may be disadvantaged, particularly in households where family cars are high-powered.

Kristy Delaney, executive officer of the Youth Action and Policy Association, agreed, saying the new laws would unfairly restrict some young people.

"So many of life's opportunities depend on young people's ability to access transport," she said.

"We don't want to see anyone's opportunities become limited because they are not allowed to drive their parent's cars."

Mr Costa said he understood that some people would be unduly affected but said the government "had to draw the line somewhere".

Central Coast resident Rebecca Stanford, 24, who was left in coma for a week after a P-plater crash in 1999, joined Mr Costa at the announcement.

She said the measures were "a step in the right direction".

"The anger you might have because you can't drive your V8 is going to be a lot less of a strong emotion than what your parents feel when they get a knock on the door," she said.

Meanwhile, NSW opposition roads spokesman Andrew Stoner said the government was ignoring the core issue - driver education.

"Labor's solutions are all punitive and do nothing to encourage or teach proper driver behaviour and educate young drivers to the risks and dangers," he said.

A second stage of measures, including possible changes to driver training, is expected to go before state cabinet in the coming months.

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #12 on: Jun 10, 2005, 02:22AM »
also in regard to this, a lot of sources will tell you ' unladen mass ' , factory standard, etc etc etc etc etc

i fought this case (in the 180sx) and won, i looked up the act in which it stipulates all of this and found nothing in relation to 'stock standard/factory standard'

so if your car is borderline, you might get away with it...

but if your in nsw, forget a turbo or v8 if your on your p's :P
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Offline DeathPlaza

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #13 on: Jun 10, 2005, 05:23AM »
OK first thing i wanna ask, cuz im not from aus. im assuming that P platers are, young drivers? or people who have got tickets? what exactly is that?  that sounds kind of good, i see WAY too many guys MY AGE with rich ass parents who buy them fast ass cars, here in america if you got the money you can do whatever you want its kindof fucked, at the same time it seems like a generalization that everyone with P plates is an inexperienced unsafe driver because i see a lot of you guys got them on your cars and i know most of you aren't insane drivers 

Meanwhile, NSW opposition roads spokesman Andrew Stoner said the government was ignoring the core issue - driver education.


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« Last Edit: Jun 10, 2005, 05:27AM by DeathPlaza »
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Offline noss

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #14 on: Jun 10, 2005, 11:37AM »
haha i love the andrew stoner bit deathplaza :P


anyway, a p plater is someone that is on their 'provisional' licence and they have to display a 'P' in their windscreen.. except if you live in queensland, the government of queensland back in the 80's decided that having to display P plates was an invasion of privacy.

generally people are on their 'p plates' for 3 years. in most states you get your p's at 18 and hold them until you're 21 unless you lose your licence, however other states you can get your p plate licence earlier and may have to hold it for longer or shorter.

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #15 on: Jun 10, 2005, 12:09PM »
ahh i see, yah i have a California provisional license because im still 17, but here once you turn 18 you automatically have a real license.  the provisional license means i can not drive people under 25 years old until i turn 18, and i  also cannot drive between the hours of 12am-5am.  But i still do, i guess if they forced me to put a big ol' "hey im under 18" sticker on my car i probably wouldn't.  Man if they passed a law that said you cant drive a car with abouts 200 hp i would have a couple friends who would have  to buy new cars lol!
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Offline Resin

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #16 on: Jun 11, 2005, 05:50PM »
http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/licensing/downloads/0605_nsw_prohibited_vehicles.pdf

cars u cant drive from the rta .............

so p platers can still drive .......cefiros, 2L 180sx's, laurels, some mustangs, and a whole range of fast cars ...... even r32 gtrs ...hehe

Offline Milford

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #17 on: Jun 11, 2005, 06:30PM »
some 6 cyl cars too
like m3's, 350z

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #18 on: Jun 11, 2005, 06:34PM »
http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/licensing/downloads/0605_nsw_prohibited_vehicles.pdf

cars u cant drive from the rta .............

so p platers can still drive .......cefiros, 2L 180sx's, laurels, some mustangs, and a whole range of fast cars ...... even r32 gtrs ...hehe
They bothered to put a U12 and U13 attesa on the list, but not a GTR, dumbasses :P

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #19 on: Jun 11, 2005, 06:39PM »
http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/licensing/gettingalicence/car/p1p2_conditions.html?lfid=1

they do say that it is all turbocharged engines that they cant drive .....

and the list will be updated

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #20 on: Jun 14, 2005, 12:49PM »
The list probably doesn't have those cars on it because they're imports and they are still restricted under the 125kW/t or 3.5l/t rule.

Quote
"I quite often see young people shooting up the F3 at great excess of the posted speed limit in high-performance vehicles and we want to make that a thing of the past," he told reporters.

I reckon the whole thing is a crock of shit... One of the guys at work has a late model Civic that fits under those rules, a stock 2001 model, and he can and does drive down the M1 between 170 and 210 km/h... idiot. Mind you he is also rich, a druggo and on a probationary licence  :o

Most Pintaras will go 170km/h at least and this is a pretty high speed in my books, so what Mr Costa is saying is a load of rubbish. It doesn't take a hi-po car to do high speeds, but it is generally safer in a hi-po car compared to the average first car (e.g. '82 Celica with retreads, stuffed rear-end bushes, out-of balance wheels and drivetrain, tired diff, dodgy brakes and a home-done wheel alignment that hit about 180km/h and had more in it - not really proud of it because it was stupid)
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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #21 on: Jun 15, 2005, 08:23PM »
I think this rule is a bit flawed but i can see where they are coming from.  For instance someone has been learning to drive in their parents Mitsubishi colt (or any low power FWD or even RWd) and then they get their Ps and decided to go buy a high powered RWD for instance a Z32.  This could be a very dangerous situation as the driver would have no real clue how to drive the car.  Maybe if i had a high powered Rwd i would think differently and i know my thinking only applies with some cases, but at the moment i dont disagree with this law.  Really it all depends on the driver, not the car.  But people are only on their Ps for a couple years, in SA its 2 1/2 at the moment.  It isnt really a long time to wait.   Just my 2 cents. 
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Offline nightmareCA20E

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #22 on: Aug 10, 2005, 09:35AM »
So i got my p's about 3 years and am still on reds (because im lazzy to go for my greens)
So What i really want to know is so after the 11, the rule ONLY applies to the people after 11 of the law applied
or IT applies to all P platers even before the rule in affect.

They bothered to put a U12 and U13 attesa on the list, but not a GTR, dumbasses :P
  agree with TAS

Well that changes my plans for a turbo charged ppinnie hehe:)
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Offline SSS

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #23 on: Aug 10, 2005, 10:20AM »
Wait til you get off your P's, simple.

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Re: Power To Weight Ratio On P Platers
« Reply #24 on: Aug 18, 2005, 08:38AM »
Damn if i was in NSW i could drive my dads Lamborghini Murcielago. Damn. Good thing i live in QLD..... If only he really had a lambo